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Thread: EGR valve and 'cheap' petrol!!!!

  
  1. #1
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    EGR valve and 'cheap' petrol!!!!

    My mother-in-law has the same car as me - 1.6 sxi, just over a year old now and on its second EGR valve.

    Its been back in 5 or 6 times now due to juddering and hesitation on acceleration. They've (Vauxhall) have either cleaned it out ot replaced the whole unit!

    Last week it went back and had its second valve, along with the explanation of 'cheap' supermarket petrol being the main reason for its malfunction!

    Now, and I'm no mechanic, surely any modern engine management system should be able to cope with differences (up to a point) in petrol grades and standards! So is this a typical fault or an indication of there being something else wrong?

    My car is over 2 years old now, and due to ASDA's points card offer they had ran exclusively on their brand for over a year!! I had no problems what-so-ever!

    Is it a driving techinique thing??
    Admittedely(????) I do boot mine, and I think shes does perhaps 'tootle about' a bit! But even so any modern car should be able to cope with all driving techniques???

    What do you think??
    ... indicators do not give you right of way!!!

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    i had a 1.8 astra sport and that did the same and i got told it was a throttle bodies problem and then it was a ecu problem, still did it when i got rid of it.....
    "we are the knights that say, ni"

    www.donnycruise.com

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    yeah!!

    you've gotta think its an ecu thing more than anything else!

    but what do I know??
    ... indicators do not give you right of way!!!

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    ive got the 1.6 sxi and its a year old and mine has had 2 EGR valves also but Vauxhall told me there was a faulty batch fitted to the cars!!

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    Ffoeg's Avatar
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    All petrol sold in this country is to BS (ISO) standard so that theory is complete and utter bull sh*t.

    Supermarkets cut the price because they can by in vast quantities, and use their own transport to deliver it. They also use different makes depending on what price they can get it for.

    I used to work near a supermarket and used to see different tankers going in each day - sometimes it was their own, sometimes Jet, conoco, and even Esso or Shell ti name but a few,

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    Ffoeg

    - thats exactly my sentiment, as you say, and I don't think Sainsbury's (whose petrol she was using) would be to happy about the slur of their product!

    A remedy Vauxhall actually suggested was to use super unleaded all the time!!!!!!!!!
    ... indicators do not give you right of way!!!

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    i'm on my second EGR valve, mine totally died, my car cut out on the motoerway and never started again when my EGR died, there was no juddering or anythin. when it was towed to vaux they told me that it was cheap petrol... i turned round and said bollox to 'em as i've alway run on bp or esso and maybe strayed to asda or tesco once or twice in a pickle. i think it may just be a weak part.

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    can someone tell me what an EGR valve is?
    My car - Rusty Custom Creations Inc....

    The only natural pilots are born with feathers.... except me.

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    Its the exhaust gas recirculation valve.

    EGR Valves have been around for a long time. Way back in 1972 GM used them in an attempt to reduce emissions of oxides of nitrogen (NOx) which were a major cause of air pollution, mainly photochemical smog, that kind of smog which is formed when strong sunlight shines down on the exhaust gasses we puke out of our tailpipes by the billions of cubic feet a day.

    A short chemistry lesson is in order here. It was discovered way back when, that high combustion chamber peak temperatures (the really short duration high temperatures near the end of the combustion process) caused oxygen and nitrogen to combine chemically and form these oxides of nitrogen mentioned above. Most of the anti-pollution devices of the day did a pretty good job of reducing the other bad by-products of combustion, namely excessive hydrocarbons and carbon monoxide, however they tended to induce the formation of oxides of nitrogen. Something had to be done else we would all die of smog diseases.

    The automotive engineers figured that they needed to do something to lower the peak combustion temperatures which only occurred under certain high load driving conditions. They figured they could do so at the expense of power and fuel economy but what the heck, ya can't have everything! If they could only add something to the combustion chamber that would act like sort of a fire extinguisher to cool the combustion temperatures that would do it.

    So they invented a way to allow some very inert gas to get back into the combustion chamber only when needed. They needed a source of this gas - it wasn't air, cuz that contains oxygen and nitrogen which caused the problem in the first place. So they chose carbon dioxide. Where to get a supply of carbon dioxide . . . ??? Hmmmm, how about the exhaust system? That is mainly carbon dioxide and water (plus a zillion other noxious chemicals) Suppose we allow some of the exhaust gas to get back into the intake manifold under strict control and only when we need it? That would cool the combustion chamber and prevent the formation of the NoX. Maybe we should call it recirculated exhaust gas (REG??). But a guy named Reginald voted no cuz he didn't want his name associated with a car part, so they called it exhaust gas recirculation (EGR) since there was nobody around with that name.

    Now we understand why it is there. And we understand what it does. So what can go wrong with it and what are the symptoms??

    It's really pretty simple - it can be open when it isn't supposed to be, or it can be closed when it is supposed to be open. Not rocket science, but it is science. If it is open when it is not supposed to be open, at idle for instance, It will act like one monster vacuum leak and the engine will not idle or will idle really roughly. If it doesn't open when it is supposed to open you will probably experience a symptom of "pinging" or "knocking" since the combustion chamber temperature will be higher than normal (one of the main causes of pinging in an engine).

    There are a zillion different types of EGR valves some of which work strictly on vacuum, and some which work on a combination of vacuum and pressure. Some have electronic controls, some have mechanical controls. I won't go into detail here about all the different types but suffice it to say that most can be checked by looking inside to see if the plunger shaft is stuck open or doesn't move when the engine is revved up (after it is warmed up). Replacement is probably the easiest part since most are held in by two small bolts and have a vacuum line connected to it. The hard part is whipping out your Visa card to pay for it since most of them will drain your reserves in a hurry!!
    Regards
    Rich C

    Former owner of Astra SXi.. New owner of a Satin Silver Civic Type R.. "Bye Bye GTi"!!

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    blimey... now there's an explanation!

    cheers, i think - still reading!



    ah.. could you find one of them in say the airbox of an old mk3 golf cl?

    in the bottom of my golf's airbox i noticed a strange thing like you describe hooked up to a vaccum pipe and with a big pipe running out of the box and under the heat shield

    so when i fitted my k&n to that car i got rid of that did i? whoops... :roll:



    lol - i ragged the tits off that car
    My car - Rusty Custom Creations Inc....

    The only natural pilots are born with feathers.... except me.

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